Hurricane Cronesmoon ([info]cronesmoon) wrote,
@ 2008-06-20 08:40:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
One-Line Religions
In the course of a novel-writing career, one frequently is obliged to describe an entire novel in one punchy sentence. "The accidental release of a bio-warfare virus will destroy life as we know it if Bo-Bo cannot convince his band of chimps to risk everything in a mad scientific gamble to save his species." Or, "This is Die Hard in Fantasyland with a talking donkey in the Bruce Willis role."

It is perhaps this bit of my personal experience that provoked me, when a dear friend asked me about my religion, to begin trying to find one-line descriptions of the world's religions. The thing is, such a description necessarily depends for brevity on certain shared references that must come from outside the religion if it is to make sense to strangers to the religion. For example, my friend, a Lutheran, gave a brief sentence to describe her religion, and it relied so heavily on references understood only to Christians that it made no sense to me. All I remember is that it was something about a trinity.

In her place I might have said, "Christianity is based on the premise that a loving god produced a son and then sacrificed (or permitted the sacrifice of) him so that any who believed in him as the son of the god might enjoy eternal benefits." Which may be wrong, but makes reasonable sense to me and is I hope not offensive. Any religion may look like superstition to those outside it, but all should be condensible to something comprehensible.

I don't do particularly well at it, though. For Buddhism the best I've been able to come up with is that the Buddha was a man who discovered a way to freedom from the suffering inherent in this world and was willing to try to show the way to others when asked. That doesn't even touch on what exactly that "way" is, but like references to the Christian trinity, everything I can think of that does address it tends to make sense only in the context of more information unavailable to most non-Buddhists. (Of course anyone can become a scholar of any religion without following it; but as most don't, I blithely disregard scholars.)

Even if you accept those descriptions, that's only two religions. Anybody else have any others? Or better versions of these two?


(Post a new comment)


[info]tenar10r
2008-06-20 02:08 pm UTC (link)
As for the Christianity in a short phrase I'd use a little verse they teach
to everyone, toddlers on up.
John 3:16 "For God so loved the world; that he gave his only son (to be sacrificed) that whomever believes in Him (that he was sacrifices to pay the blood price for everyone's sins) shall not perish (be punished after death for their sins) and have everlasting (in spirit) life."
Yes the verse needs some translating, but does offer a starting point to further spiritual conversations.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]cronesmoon
2008-06-20 05:12 pm UTC (link)
Thanks! That's actually what I was after, but dumping the original for the briefer and more comprehensible translation. It doesn't seem to me to add anything to leave in the actual verse; it just makes a longer, less punchy one-liner. Am I missing something?

Incidentally when I was taught it (missionaries came to our school: Mum was rightly cross when she heard of it afterward), it was "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in him shall not perish, but have everlasting life." Doubtless an ancient translation, but rather pretty, I thought.

And that's the sum total of my formal training in Christianity. I was awarded a little pocket-sized The New Testament for memorizing that verse, and I cherished the delicacy of its pages, but didn't find it a compelling read. Well, I was probably eight or nine, so I expect I can be excused for that.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]tenar10r
2008-06-20 05:31 pm UTC (link)
That is the "King James" version; much better sounding than many modern versions. I think it is also the most commonly used version; it seems to make people more comfortable with all the "thee"s and "thou"s.

It is funny how people will imitate the "thee"s and "thou"s trying to sound formal when "thee" was the informal/intimate/family/good-close-friend way of saying "You" where as using "you" was the formal. I guess it just show how little people understand about the English language.

The King James version was also where 'poisoner' - someone who would go to other villages and poison the wells for warfare or revenge- got translated to "witch" and we all know what a marshmallow roast that turned into.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]cronesmoon
2008-06-20 09:56 pm UTC (link)
It's like The Silmarilion: the fancy language lends verisimilitude "to an otherwise bald and unconvincing narrative." (Sorry, couldn't resist.) No, but seriously, it really is right pretty for the purpose.

It irks me that people can't figure out how to use "thee" and "thou," since the rules seem quite simple to me; but people really aren't much taught rules of language these days. And the rules they are taught tend to be either silly ("never end a sentence with a preposition") or just wrong ("any use of 'to be,' in any form, constitutes the passive voice [which is always to be avoided]").

Regarding poisoners and witches (OMG WTF Never Again The Burning Times!!111eleventy!), there's some small controversy as to what the word may actually have been, but yeah. As you say, that seems to be a translation in which things were ... interpreted, shall we say? rather loosely, to please the then-current administration. I believe it's also that version that is said by some to have introduced the Christian aversion to homosexuality. It is to sigh.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]twyleth_teg
2008-06-21 08:45 am UTC (link)
Lutheran? You got it close enough, it works. :D
I got glared at one sunday morning by a double handful of bluehaired old biddies for saying after the service that "a 3000 year old book of lies lust murder & greed is, really, a great thing to base a religion on." [Or something to that effect] But their horrified jaw-drop expressions were perfect.[rather similar to the one my mom made when I unthinkingly downed a glass of communion wine like a shot...]
The bibles an amusing read. Is it "the literal word of god" [edited a bazillion times] I dunno. [I figure its like a celestial game of "telephone"- some of the original message probably made it through but you don't know what exactly got changed on the way down the line. :)]
But im not gonna hassle people over it or if their version/sect/pet theory is "The" right one. [my roomie made an intersting point the other day: if you're "saved" and you know youre saved -a ballsy assumption on it's own, and one that most likely means youre not- whats to stop you from doing all sorts of bad things? rape? murder, who cares- youre saved, you get into heaven [valhalla, elesian fields, etc] regardless?

Hmmm my knowledge of Buddism is rather limitedand I knoew it varies widly with different sects and in different countries. Don't you want to expirience life and all the things that go with it- pain, hunger, sadness and so forth so you learn humility and start looking for a way to get of the wheel and/stop reincarnating and get enlightenment? [Which once gained, destroys your soul or something doesnt it?, sends you willingly into Oblivion?]

From what I"ve read about the Navajo mythology they try to adapt when things change and live in harmony with their suroundings, no matter what hapens. Then when they die all their good bits poof off into oblivion and their bad side continues to wander the earth as an angry ghost. :)

Thats more then a sentance... and I'm rambling aren't i? oh well :P

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]cronesmoon
2008-06-21 12:33 pm UTC (link)
The Christian Bible is only 2000 years old (or a bit less), not 3000; but your points are interesting. I think the assumption (by those for whom the Bible is the literal word of their god) is that the god oversaw the revisions as he did the original writing, so that his intent shines through. Anyway that wouldn't change the one-line definition of the religion.

(Incidentally your roomie should apply logic: though the wording is, in fact, that you have only to believe, I think the implication is that you must behave in certain ways as a result of that belief. Like obeying the commandments, frex. Which would preclude rape and murder.)

Your description of Buddhism contains elements I recognize. I think many outside the religion might define it by the effort to get off that wheel, and I know at least one Buddhist who refers to "the original meaning of nirvana" as "extinction." (She seems unaware that the extinction in question was not of a mythical person or "soul" but of desire.) But none of that defines Buddhism, or even a given Buddhist sect.

I see where you're going with each of these: to you, a religion is defined by what it seems to say will happen to you when you die, right? But that can vary from one sect to another, as can most of the trappings of what happens while you're still living, so I'm trying to get at the central thing that doesn't change from one sect to another in a given religion.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]twyleth_teg
2008-06-23 07:01 am UTC (link)
I think my roomie meant any of those religions of "youre saved= collect 200$" christian based or no. :)

Itsnt the point of having a religon what happens after you die? I mean as far as anyone knows we only get this one life, 40, 60, 80 years and then what? well.... nobody knows. But it would sure be nice if something good happened after death, right? where we all hang out with our upity-great grandparents, crazy aunt suzy, the pet goldfish, the puppy that got whacked by a car when you were three and that hot but brainless chick you dated in highschool and, oh, montezuuma and attilla the hun and the popes white elephent... in a giant eternal block party of free beer and bbq.
Or something. Cause thats cirtanly not my idea of heaven! but then I dont really want to crew a giant ship made of untrimmed fingernails or be an empty shade for eternity either. And I really hope I don't need grave goods- after a couple hundred years -if not sooner with grave robbers or pothnters- thats rotted, broken, gone and youre screwed until the end of time :D

And whats religion but a set of codes and belifs that explain what exactly happens after you die and the assorted ways you can get there: what to do, what not to do, what sacrifices need to be made on which days and so forth.

*Grin* Thats one constant amusement about religion, any of them: nobody knows if they're right, if ones right, if any are! Is the world really going to end in 2012? and if it did would we know? or is the sun's evetual implosion and planet-eating expansion in 700 million years going to do it regardless..
So, yum, yeah. I'm not really quite sure what else religion could be,is suposed to be, if not the path to the afterlife?
Which is not to say that there isnt the posibility of more then one lifetime but in case there isnt I see no reason not to enjoy this one, which I *think* some religions kinda frown on. [Not only will I shop on a sunday, I'll dance on it too :)]

I'll stop abusing your poor LJ now XD
Don't mean to ofend if i inadvertently did :P

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]cronesmoon
2008-06-23 01:01 pm UTC (link)
Regarding your roomie, what would it matter whether it's Christian or another religion? If it has a "saved" category, as far as I know that's never a token you can put in your pocket and then forget about the teachings of the religion and still expect the token to provide entry somewhere. Sorry, but the very idea is just lame. The idea is always to believe and behave, not to buy a ticket with lip service and then go on your separate way.

And no, I don't think the point of religion for most of us is what happens after one dies. I, for example, am not particularly interested in what will happen after I die. "I" won't be there. I want to help assure the best possible future I can for those who come after me, but I'm not hoarding brownie points for some unknowable afterlife. I'm just trying to do what's right in this life. Because I find that the most comfortable way to live.

For many of us the point of a religion is just that: to help in some way with this life, right here, right now. Mine, frex, helps me to a better understanding, empathy, and enjoyment in this life. It encourages mindfulness and harmlessness, that one might be better able to live with oneself and others. (Not that I succeed at either of these practices, but the effort is there.)

But of course not all would define Buddhism as "religion," so it might not fairly count in a discussion of what constitutes a religion. Still, I think most if not all of those that do address an afterlife in some detail do it as a way of guiding behavior in this life.

But I'm not awfully well-read myself on this subject, so I could easily be wrong.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]2ndsoprano
2008-06-23 02:52 pm UTC (link)
Having been raised Christian, I can say (pretty much) that you are right: there isn't a branch of Christianity that I know of that gives anyone a "free ride" to Paradise. Even the most radical "embrace Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour and you will be saved" sects have conditions attached. Because if you only say you have, but go around lying, cheating, stealing, raping, killing, etc, then you have NOT truly embraced Jesus as your Saviour and will not be saved. And, yeah, there are sects that are focused on the afterlife, and view this mortal life as a stepping stone to that, but you still gotta earn the right to be saved.

Love God, Live Right, Be Saved...

(Reply to this)


Create an Account
Forgot your login or password?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…